Last week I posted a blog here inviting conversation on a controversial subject. I opened the conversation by saying
“The discussion is now open and public. Everyone gets to have an opinion and hopefully, some of those will be backed by serious thought and serious spiritual self soul-searching.”
I wanted discussion with other Christians on a difficult subject. My opinions are a “work-in-progress.” My opinions are not an attack on the Bible. They’re not meant as a replacement of it. They are my own feeble attempt to understand it and ask others to clarify me.
Since then, I have been pretty viciously and personally attacked for even raising the subject and offering some thoughts to begin a discussion. Even worse, many of these have been directed toward friends, artists, and co-workers who had nothing at all to do with the post.
Since this episode began last week, my life has been in turmoil. It is one thing to see these vicious attitudes expressed in other SG blogs and forums; it something else entirely to have them aimed directly at me, the people I work with, and artists I work for. Some of my friends have said “What were you thinking? You had to know this would happen. This is a subject you just can’t talk about. It’s not worth it. It affects all of us.”
So. To anyone who has been hurt or offended by my attempt, especially artists and co-workers, I sincerely apologize. That was not my intention. I have removed the post.
I believe the Bible to be the inspired Word of God. I believe those who wrote it had their thoughts, hands and pens guided by Him. Unfortunately, I am not inspired as they. I am a fallible human being, saved by Grace. I often do not understand His Word because my thoughts and pen are not so inspired. And, like all of you, because I am not so inspired, I often have to grapple and struggle to understand what is in there. I try to do that. I pray, read books, ask questions, and have discussions with other people. I study. Sometimes these efforts help me understand. Sometimes not. Sometimes I make mistakes, seek forgiveness and go on. We are all learning as we go. None of us “has it right” yet.
For those of you who seem to be way more certain than I, and who wish to shout judgments from the rooftops, I say, “Have at it.” You get to have your say.
For those who know me and know that I have sincerely dedicated many years of my life to bringing people to Christ through music, I would certainly welcome your forgiveness for putting you in a bad position because of your association with me.
I continue to be dedicated in my own fallible way, to pray for direction, and to listen to Him.
In the words of Forrest Gump “I’m not a smart man, but I know what love is”, God is love! Just read 1Jo 4:16 -21, it’s always amazing to me that the one section of verses (depending on which translation you read) always override all the ones about Jesus loving, helping and dying for everyone. It seems that we (Christians) always want to shoot each other before we focus on a world that needs the good news of a Savior. Not to say that I agree with Mr. Gamble’s point of view, to me his article was more about pushing people out because they’re different. Maybe hating the sin and the sinner because they’re different shouldn’t be our stance on any issue. I hate that someone of Mr. Gamble’s prominence in the genre of Southern Gospel music was so tarnished over one questionable article. And if you were one of the people that “viciously and personally attacked”, you should repent and apologize. “I’m just saying”!!
“I believe the Bible to be the inspired Word of God. I believe those who wrote it had their thoughts, hands and pens guided by Him. Unfortunately, I am not inspired as they. I am a fallible human being, saved by Grace. I often do not understand His Word because my thoughts and pen are not so inspired. And, like all of you, because I am not so inspired, I often have to grapple and struggle to understand what is in there. I try to do that. I pray, read books, ask questions, and have discussions with other people. I study. Sometimes these efforts help me understand. Sometimes not. Sometimes I make mistakes, seek forgiveness and go on. We are all learning as we go. None of us “has it right” yet.”
That is a profound paragraph … easily some of the best writing I’ve seen lately.
Mr. Gamble,
I hate to hear that you were personally attacked for your article. While I found myself in complete disagreement, I did enjoy having the little conversation we did have on the issue. I hope you had a chance to read some of the info I referenced. Bottom line, we as Christians have to accept the Bible (God’s Word) for what it is, truth. There are some subjects that can be somewhat divisive if people are not willing to accept that fact. I have no fear of scientific discussion on these issues either. There can be no fact without absolute proof and facts will never contradict the truth. There will be many hypothesis and even some theories that turn out to not be fact. If we are going to look at science (as you and I did) to explore an issue, we as Christians have to be secure enough in our faith to know that the facts can never and will never contradict truth. If God did indeed create this world, and the contents of this world, then the facts will always align with the truth. If a hypothesis does not align with the truth, then it will be proven false or never reach a consensus. The same with a theory. On the other hand, if the hypothesis or theory aligns with the truth, it will most likely become scientific fact.
I sincerely hope you did not feel that my post was a personal attack on you in any way. I would not begin to do that. My last response was indeed an attack on incomplete/ flawed research that was in contradiction to that “Inspired” Word you have admitted to stuggling with to understand. I pray that God gives you clarity as you seek understanding.
Mr. Gamble, none of us knows everything. But we can rest assured in the truth and infallibility of scripture. The Word of God is fact. It has not fallen yet and never will. It has not been disproven yet by any scientific evidence (as clearly pointed out in by my response to the controversial post). If God’s word calls this “controvesial subject” sin, then that is exactly what it is. If you truly want to have that conversation, you have my email. Feel free to use it and rest assured that the conversation will remain confidential and non-judgemental. I am not afraid to talk about such issues, but I do recognize the firestorm such issues can and will cause. So I answer your question ,”Can We Talk?”, with a question. Yes we can talk, now do you really want to? The invitation has been extended.
The discussion was flawed, like all of us, very early on. We started talking “science” and the Bible. Just ask “science” how the earth was formed and how old the earth is and those responses will directly contradict what the Bible teaches. Not to say that science it all bad, but you can’t really trust anything but the word of God because we can make the numbers say anything we want. As for me, I will stick with the old adage, “God’s word says it, I believe it, and that settles it”. However, even if “we” don’t believe it, His word is infallible and still settles it. Those that are not what God wants them to be are always welcome to come, and we can just pray that we all can allow ourselves to be molded into what He wants us to be to be used of him.
I have to say I found your blog fascinating. Only because I myself….a born-again Christian, find myself struggling with this issue. Not about being a homosexual (happily married), but about how we react to them. It does say in the Bible that homosexuality is a sin…it even says abomination…but if that’s the case, is that particualr sin more “sinful” than other sins? We hold rallies about it, we vote against it. It drives our every day conversations. Yet, what have we done about gossip? What have we done about divorce? Does a candidate being divorced keep us from voting for him. If so, then John McCain fits into that mold. Or, is is that that sin is put into “levels” – some “levels” are worse than others. I was taught that sin is sin. That God doesn’t view one as worse than any other..it’s all covered by grace. But, then, what determines when it’s covered and when it isn’t? We don’t march over divorce…we don’t protest over gossip…we don’t hold rallies over gluttony or lying. But they’re all sin. A very eye-opening, life changing book for me was Phillip Yancey’s “What’s So Amazing about Grace”…we’re all sinners…we all sin, we all fail, we all disappoint God. But His grace covers our sin. I don’t understand homosexuality. I have a dear friend who is Gay. And I struggle with how to be a friend to her. She profession christianity, and who am I to judge her. That’s between she and God…only God knows her heart. And I know that everyone says “well, if you’re a christian, then you can’t continually sin. And I agree with that. Jesus told the woman at the well to go and sin no more…but he showed her love first. Because had he turned her away, she would never have seen her own sin. She would only have seen a religous man with no compassion for her problems. But, Jesus had MUCH compassion for her…even knowing her sin..he still loved her and showed her kindness. Do we as Christians show enough love? Do we show compassion and kindness, or are we too busy pointing out their sin that we refuse to get to know them? Jesus hung out with people that the world would say were not nice people. But it’s not the Christians that need saved. I struggle with where we as christians draw the line..where do we say, ok, I can’t support that. I struggle with voting for someone just because they’re republcian when I don’t really believe in what he stands for. And yet, it’s my duty to vote…but to vote for the “lesser of the two evils”…how is that pleasing to God? I am not an Obama fan – but he’s my president, and I will pray for him. But, I was not a McCain fan either…his beliefs come no where close to mine…and yet I put some of those things aside when I voted for him. As christians, we make choices. I guess we should always choose love, grace, compassion and kindness over hatred, judgements, chastisement and cruelty. I still believe homosexuality is a sin – but is it any worse than any other sin? if you answer yes, then does God have to give more grace for that sin? Grace is grace…we all need it…none of us deserve it. That seems to make the playing field pretty level for all of us. We still have to CHOOSE to accept it…but it’s there for ANYONE who wants to receive it. If it’s available for a liar, a gossip, a divorcee and a glutton, should it not be there also for a homosexual?
“But, then, what determines when it’s covered and when it isn’t?”
The answer is pretty simple. Unrepentent sin, sin that has not been repented of, is not covered. To understand that, then we have to understand the meaning of the word repent. It is not just about aknowledging the sin, or even Christ’s sacrifice to provide the covering. It is about turning from the sin, being a new creature in Christ and allowing the sacrifice of His blood to not only cover the sin, but remove it. I have stated before that temptation in itself is not sin. The temptation to commit sin (whether it be gossip, fornication, homosexuality, alcoholism, drugs, etc.) will not go away over night and in most instances will never completely go away. To live a life defined by sin (homosexual) is not a picture of repentence. It is choosing to allow a particular sin or temptation to define who you are instead of allowing God’s design to define who you are. It is deciding to be god instead of submitting to God in an area of your life. The issue becomes much more than just the initial sin, but whether or not allowing it to define you is making it god in your own life. It becomes an idol. God is clear on the issue of where He is to be in our lives, first. Therefor, there can be no such thing as a gay christian. Why? Because the sin is being used as an adjective to describe the noun. The sin is being placed first, instead of God being placed first. Therefor, there can be a such thing as a Christian fighting against the temptation of homosexuality, just like there are Christians fighting against the temptation to lust, gossip, etc., but there can be no such thing as a gay Christian.
We as Christians can’t support sin, in our lives or the lives of others. You will never be able to point to an instance where Jesus did this. True, He showed love to the sinful, but never showed love to the sin ( that is why He said “Go and sin no more”). That is the way we are supposed to approach people. You do not beat someone over the head with a Bible to bring them to Christ. You show them the love He showed you. A love so powerful and so deep to not leave you as you are when you find Him. A love that will change you and that person into a reflection of Him, the image we are originally created in that sin has distorted.
Grace is there for anyone who will recieve it. However, grace has a way of changing people. To truly recieve grace is to also recognize the need for it and the willingness to allow it to remove the reason (sin) for needing it to begin with. Grace will only come after repentence. That may not be popular, but it is Biblical. Sadly, in many churches today you will not hear that.
I agree 100% SGMusician. It couldn’t have been put any better. This needs to be shared with a lost and dying world from every pulpit. None of us are perfect, but we have to turn from the sin in order to repent.
Such beautiful truth, you shared SGMusician.
I love the way the late, William MacDonald states in Believers Bible Commentary, “… there is a difference between a practicing homosexual and having a homosexual tendency. It is the practice
that the Bible condemns, not the orientation. There are many who have an attraction to their own
sex but refuse to give into it…Every fallen child of Adam has evil tendencies…The sin is not in being
tempted,but in yielding to the temptation… Christians should accept gays and lesbians as persons without approving their lifestyle. They are people for whom Christ died…seek in every possible way
to win them to a life of “holiness, without which no one will see the Lord” (Hebrews 12: 14)…..”
May we always share Gods’ love and truth together.